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 Friday, September 04, 2009
Ridiculous Statistic: Poetry Rejections
Posted by Robert
Earlier this week, I was asked a pretty ridiculous question: How many poetry submissions (or poems) get rejected by American poetry journals (per year)?
It's not so ridiculous, I suppose, if you're just guesstimating an approximation. But then, the person (I'll let him remain anonymous) went on to ask if I can forward him to a resource that knows the answer if I do not. (And, by the way, he's already consulted poets.org, pw.org, The NY Public Library, and the Library of Congress.)
I'm not surprised he wasn't able to find an answer, because any answer he could have received would've been completely and utterly bogus.
To determine a specific number would require:
- Knowing every journal (big and small press) that receives poetry submissions each year.
- Knowing how many submissions (or poems) are rejected by each journal.
The first part is a lot more difficult than it seems. Even the best directories, do not list every small press journal on the market. Are there 500 literary journals accepting poetry submissions? Are there 5,000? Do high school and college publications count? Where is the line drawn exactly if you want an exact number?
The second part is even harder to figure out. Most editors don't even know how many submissions (or poems) they reject a year. They give approximations like, "We only accept less than 1% of what's submitted," or, "We reject 500 poems every poem we publish." If a journal can't even give you a specific number, how can you give an accurate (or near accurate) answer?
Bottom line: You can't.
More than a million poems are likely rejected each year by American poetry journals. I'm not sure what the point of getting any more specific would accomplish. In fact, I'm not sure why a general knowledge even matters. At the end of the day, it's just another silly, ridiculous statistic.
Poets will continue to write and submit their poetry despite the odds. And I think that's exactly how it should be.
*****
Looking for more poetry-related information?
Commentary | Personal Updates | Poetry FAQs | Poetry Publishing
Friday, September 04, 2009 7:10:10 PM (GMT Daylight Time, UTC+01:00)
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 Wednesday, August 19, 2009
How much money does a poet make?
Posted by Robert
Since I'm the editor of Writer's Market and Poet's Market, writers send in questions all the time with questions about craft, publishing, marketing, etc. One of the questions I always hate to answer the most is something along the lines of, "I've been writing poems a long time now, and I think I'm ready to commit to it full time. How much money can I expect to make for my poetry?"
The reason I hate this question is that I feel like I either have to crush someone's dreams or lie. And I'm no good at lying. So, I end up saying (in as much of a non-dreamcrusher manner as I can muster) something along the lines of, "Well...umm...not much, if anything."
There are prizes, fellowships, etc., that are bestowed upon poets. But even if you win a $1,000 book prize every month (which isn't going to happen), you still won't be able to quit your day job--because you'll have to pay for postage, paper, and entry fees for all these contests, fellowships, etc.
Many journals pay in contributor copies (and some don't even do that). The few that can afford to pay in actual money usually offer less than $100 for a poem. And publishing a book isn't going to rake in the cash either. Don't believe me? Go to your local bookstore and find the poetry section (if you don't already know where it's at, it may take you a while). Look at the small offering of poets. Few of them are probably still alive. Fewer still probably don't fall into one of these categories:
- Celebrity poet. Billy Corgan, Jewel, etc.
- National Poet Laureate. Ted Kooser, Billy Collins, Robert Pinsky, etc.
So, bottom line: There's no money in poetry.
But is that such a bad thing? I think the lack of money in poetry helps take the pressure off the art form. It's really all about a great line, a wonderful image, something that sticks with the reader.
Sure, we all still want to get published and share our thoughts and words with the world; and sure, we'd all love it if someone paid us just to sit around and write poetry all day; but, we know that even if we don't have that situation (even if we're not getting published or getting paid) that we'll still put pen to paper (or fingertips to keyboard) and crank out poems from time to time. Just for the love of it.
*****
Looking for more poetry-related information?
Advice | Personal Updates | Poetry FAQs | Poetry Publishing
Wednesday, August 19, 2009 3:15:03 AM (GMT Daylight Time, UTC+01:00)
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 Tuesday, March 24, 2009
Poetry FAQs: How do you make time to write?
Posted by Robert
Seems like many writers often lament they don't have enough time to write. Some of these writers ask me how I do it, or wonder aloud how writers like Joyce Carol Oates or Stephen King publish so much so often. I can't speak for other writers, but I can give my own take on the topic of making time to write: I've almost always got time.
That's not to say I'm not busy-busy-busy. As anyone who knows me in real life can attest, I'm tremendously busy and productive all the time--from cooking and cleaning at home to editing books and coding databases for work (which also just happens to take place at home). I say I've almost always got time, because I make time for my writing. And I improvise.
For instance, this past Saturday, I spent a delightful afternoon in Atlanta with my wife, son, and mother (who was visiting from Ohio) by eating at The Varsity, strolling past the Fox Theatre, and walking around Stone Mountain. Ideas and images flooded my brain, but I had neither pen nor paper. In fact, many of the no-time writers mentioned above would say I had no time either. Quite a predicament!
Here's how I improvised: I still had a cell phone, so I started typing a text message to myself of the lines rolling around in my head. When I finished, I saved the text to my drafts (I could've also sent them to my email address). Since the day was an inspiring one, I did this a few times on Saturday--all while enjoying the day with my wife, son, and mother.
Other ways I've written through the years have included (but are not limited to) writing on napkins, receipts, placemats, business cards, flyers, menus, Post-It notes, etc. If there's the tiniest bit of white space (and you have a writing utensil--even a crayon will do), then you can write.
Since I usually like to carry a pen and paper (folded in my pocket), I've written in several locations and situations, including conferences, meetings, nature trails, family reunions, theaters, restaurants, playgrounds (with my boys), sporting events, etc. And while I don't encourage others to do this--because it's extremely dangerous (for yourself and others)--I write when I'm driving. Basically, I write almost anywhere and everywhere. No excuses about time or location.
If you really want to write, I'm sure you're always ready and able to do the same.
Advice | Personal Updates | Poetry FAQs
Tuesday, March 24, 2009 7:32:03 PM (GMT Standard Time, UTC+00:00)
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 Thursday, March 05, 2009
Poetry FAQs: What is getting published?
Posted by Robert
Whether it's concerning fiction, nonfiction, poetry, script writing, etc., one of the more common questions I get asked by writers is something along the lines of, "What is getting published now?," which also can be re-phrased as, "What is currently hot in publishing?"
Writers naturally want to find success in their craft and trade--just as people who golf or run seek success at whatever level they participate. In golfing and running, it's easier to track progress. For golfing, you know you're doing better if your scores are going down. For running, you know you're doing better when your times are dropping or when you're covering longer distances. So writers naturally look for a way to measure their success in writing and often use publishing, financial reward, and/or critical acceptance as their measures. And these can be good measures if you're following your own path.
In publishing (and writing), you don't want to follow trends for the sake of getting published, seeking financial reward, and/or critical acceptance. And here's why: Trends are moving targets.
Usually by the time a trend is established, there are already experts working the trend backwards and forwards. So, there isn't room for newbies unless you have a significantly different take on the established trend. In other words, following what's hot now doesn't guarantee publication in the future.
So, of course, if publication is guaranteed, then financial compensation isn't guaranteed either.
Since we're talking poetry here, financial compensation shouldn't be a big concern anyway, because there's not a lot of money to go around in the first place. But even if you secure publication, you may want critical recognition, which will be very hard to come by if it's perceived that you're just following a trend.
No. You need to pay attention to what's happening around you, including what you like and don't like. But then, you've got to march forward with your own vision. You need to do YOUR thing.
Rejections will happen whether you follow the trends or not. Acceptances will, too. But if you're marching to your own beat, then you'll find that eventually other writers may be following you. Plus, as you find success, you'll realize there's more reason to feel confident with your own voice.
Poetry FAQs | Poetry Publishing
Thursday, March 05, 2009 1:52:15 PM (GMT Standard Time, UTC+00:00)
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 Tuesday, February 17, 2009
Poetry FAQs: When is a long response too long?
Posted by Robert
I received the following question via e-mail from a poet who wishes to remain anonymous:
I recently received a letter from a well-respected poetry print publication after my query regarding my submission which was held longer then their guidelines stated. The reply I received was that my work was still under consideration. Was this good news or just nothing?
How long should I expect to wait. Their reading of submissions ends shortly. Do I query again? Can I assume this is dead in the water, and rather then just sending me a rejection they sent this letter stating my work was still under consideration? They state in the letter it could take up to 5 months for their editors to respond to submissions, but it's been much longer than 5 months when I sent the query to begin with.
Believe me, editors (especially of well-respected publications) are not afraid to send rejection notes. So, it's not good news yet (because your work hasn't been accepted), but it's not bad news either. Unless you don't like waiting around for responses.
If you're tired of waiting and the well-respected publication doesn't allow simultaneous submissions, then you can always respectfully pull your work from their consideration. Or you can move on as if it was rejected.
Many editors go over their stated guidelines, especially when they are drowning in submissions from eager writers. Often, response estimates are given by editors who are overly optimistic about how quick they'll get through everything.
One way to avoid this problem, of course, is to only submit to publications that accept simultaneous submissions. While I'm not a simultaneous submitter myself, many well-published poets are. If you go down that road, just make sure you have a good submission tracking system in place--so that you can notify journals when specific poems have been accepted for publication.
*****
Click here to check out other Poetry FAQs from Poetic Asides: http://blog.writersdigest.com/poeticasides/CategoryView,category,Poetry%20FAQs.aspx.
*****
If you wish to submit a question, e-mail me at robert.brewer@fwmedia.com with the subject line: "Poetry Question".
Advice | Poetry FAQs | Poetry Publishing
Tuesday, February 17, 2009 1:33:31 AM (GMT Standard Time, UTC+00:00)
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 Thursday, January 08, 2009
Poetry FAQs: What can be done with an accepted poem?
Posted by Robert
It's been some time since I've tackled a poetry question. This question was sent in a while ago, and deals with a situation I've experienced personally myself (and is probably common to many poets who've submitted their work long enough).
What can/can't we do with a poem that was either accepted by a journal and then never used, or accepted by a journal that died before they used it?
First off, let me just say that I'm not a lawyer, so don't take my word as law. That said, I can't imagine a lawsuit involving poetry, and I'm married to a paralegal.
I'll address the latter case first (the journal that died before using the poem). Unless the journal bought the rights to your poem before dying, I don't see any reason why the poem would not still be considered unpublished. While it's disappointing that the poem was so close to publication, you should be able to move the poem back into your bin of poems that need to be submitted.
If you were paid for the poem already, then you may need to contact the editors about releasing the rights to your poem. But if the journal died before they used the poem, you probably weren't paid.
The other case (the journal that accepts a poem and never uses it) is only a little more complex. If the journal accepted your poem and has not paid you for it, then contact the editor to find out what he or she plans to do with the poem. If the editor does not have an acceptable answer to your query, then request that it be removed from consideration in a future edition of the publication. And I suggest being nice about how you handle this, especially if you may wish to submit to that particular publication or editor again. In this case, as above, the poem would still be considered unpublished.
If the journal accepted your poem and has paid you for it, things can get a little trickier. Most likely, you will need to pay back the publisher, and there's even the (very slight) possibility that the publication will not release the first publication rights to the poem. I doubt the situation would come to this in 99.9% of the cases. Most editors/publishers want to work with writers, not against them.
*****
Click here for other Poetry FAQs.
If you don't find an answer to your question there, then feel free to send me an e-mail at robert.brewer@fwmedia.com.
Personal Updates | Poetry FAQs | Poetry Publishing
Thursday, January 08, 2009 2:47:28 PM (GMT Standard Time, UTC+00:00)
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 Thursday, September 25, 2008
Poetry FAQs: When is something considered published?
Posted by Robert
Okay, this question has been coming up a lot recently in the comments section of this blog: What counts as previously published? And, in relation to this blog, does posting a poem in the comments of this blog mean it's "published"?
Before I begin, I think it would be beneficial for you to read this post from former co-blogger and Poet's Market editor Nancy Breen about the whole publishing question in "Published is Published!"
For Individual Poems
Many editors consider anything published anywhere at any time under any circumstances as published. This can even include public readings. And if a publication specifies what they consider published in their guidelines, it would behoove a poet (or any writer really) to respect the editor's considerations.
With such editors, a poem posted anywhere counts as publication, whether it's posted in a public forum or blog, or even a private, password-protected location online. In such cases, poems posted on this blog would be considered "previously published." However, there are editors who take a slightly different view.
Some editors consider a poem unpublished if it only displays on a personal blog and/or is in a "draft" form in a forum or blog. That is, if your poem on Poetic Asides is only a rough draft and not the final version, it would not be considered "previously published." If editors do not specify what they consider previously published, there's a good chance they fall into this camp.
For Poetry Collections
Except for rare cases, most editors/publishers of poetry collections accept previously published poems as long as the collection itself has not been previously published. Actually, the fact that poems are previously published usually helps in getting the collection published. That said, do NOT try to use poems posted on a personal blog or public forum as a publishing credit. Such credits hold little weight, since there is usually no screening process, because eveyone can get published.
My main point here is that individual poems that are considered published by journals can still be considered unpublished as components of a poetry collection. And that even individual poems that are considered published are welcome in "original" collections of poems.
In fact, "new collections" can be made from selecting poems from previous full-length collections and chapbooks.
So, How Should Poets Proceed?
Armed with your knowledge of what is and is not considered published, you've just got to pick your battles and act accordingly. For instance, most of my poems are not published on my blog, because I want to have as many publishing options available to me as possible. I share drafts of these "unpublished" poems with close poet friends to solicit feedback for revisions.
The poems I post as parts of prompts, I consider "published," though I would not use it as a publishing credit if I tried including any of them in a collection, because I also consider my poems on this blog to be "vanity publication credits." I make an informed decision to write a poem a week just for the act of creation.
Considering how much money most published poets make anyway, I don't view this as such a bad decision. But every poet has to make this decision on their own.
Commentary | General | Personal Updates | Poetry Craft Tips | Poetry FAQs | Poetry Publishing | Poets
Thursday, September 25, 2008 5:59:42 PM (GMT Daylight Time, UTC+01:00)
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 Thursday, August 28, 2008
Poetry FAQs: Is it easier to get published online than in print?
Posted by Robert
Well, I just finished my annual bookstore tour for Market Books of Southwest Ohio (thanks to Joseph Beth in Cincy and Books & Co. in Dayton!), and I found it interesting that this same question was asked at both locations by different groups of writers: Is it easier to get published online than in print?
The assumption I think most writers (poets included) make is that online is somehow an easier route to getting published. But I don't think that's necessarily true. Online or off, there is still an editor (or group of editors) looking for quality work, usually with a certain aesthetic in mind whether that be formal verse, narrative, experimental, or some other type of style.
A few years ago, one could make the argument that there were more writers submitting to print publications than online publications. However, with the global reach of established online sites and the limited print runs of literary journals, that pendulum may be swinging the other way.
It should also be noted that as online sites, such as The Pedestal and Boxcar Review, come up with money to pay writers there's less of a resistance among writers to publish their work in one place over another. After all, what's even better than getting your work published? Getting your work published and getting paid for it.
So anyway, here's the short answer I give to writers at bookstores and conferences when they ask if it is easier to get published online than in print:
No. Personal Updates | Poetry FAQs | Poetry Publishing | Poets
Thursday, August 28, 2008 7:23:28 PM (GMT Daylight Time, UTC+01:00)
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 Friday, August 15, 2008
Poetry FAQs: Having what it takes to be a poet
Posted by Robert
Earlier this week, I received a long e-mail from an anonymous Poetic Asides reader who asked important questions I'm sure all poets have asked themselves at some point or another in their poetic development. Here's some of the e-mail:
"I want to put together a book of poetry. I have the subject already in mind. Here's the thing. I am a fly-by-night poet. I have a hard question for you. Do you think I have what it takes to make it as a poet from having read some of my work?
"I sent in six poems to a local competition this year and didn't make it even as an honorable mention. I also sent in five or six to the Writer's Digest competition in December. I haven't heard anything, so am assuming that I didn't make the cut. Now we are talking 100 poets who made it, and I didn't get there.
"Anyway, I turn to you in a moment of despair. I am feeling low and just want a crumb to pull me out of this mist. However, honesty is what I need."
And my honesty is what this poet will get.
First, I don't advise poets to try thinking about putting together books of poetry until they've published some individual poems. It's not that a poet can't do this, but by entering competitions, I'm assuming that a poet wants some kind of recognition, and publication is a great form of recognition.
Second, contests are great, but they are competitions, which means there are several other poets battling it out for the top poem(s). If Writer's Digest recognizes 100 poets, for instance, then they must receive thousands of entries for the competition. Keep in mind that most competitions produce a minority of winners and a majority of losers.
Third, I'd suggest spending less time entering competitions and instead submitting to online and print publications that publish poetry that fits your style. Yes, this means you should devote time to reading online and print journals to see what fits. (Note: This is also a great way to learn from what works and doesn't work in other poets' poems.)
Fourth, it sounds like you need involvement with other poets, whether online or in person. I would suggest trying to get a small critique group together, either by contacting other poets online or trying to do so locally--either through your local library or bookstore. You'd be surprised how many poets are all around us.
Finally, only you can say if you have what it takes to be a poet. Do you feel compelled to write poems even facing the possibility that no one will ever read your work? If so, you are and will always be a poet. Poetry is not a form of writing that will earn you much fortune and glory, so using recognition as your "poet worth" gauge is probably not the best idea.
However, recognition can be a powerful fuel for the poetic motor. So get involved with some other poets; read and submit to publications; and keep writing. The rest will take care of itself.
Advice | Poetry Craft Tips | Poetry FAQs | Poetry Publishing
Friday, August 15, 2008 3:11:41 PM (GMT Daylight Time, UTC+01:00)
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 Friday, July 11, 2008
Poetry FAQs: Making Your Mark
Posted by Robert
So an anonymous poet recently sent me the following message:
"I was just curious to know how I can go about getting my name out there and getting my poetry published. I love to write and I am very anxious, but I just don't know where to start. This is all new to me. If you could help me that would be great."
To answer this, I'm going to make an assumption that this poet has already spent a good deal of time working on her craft and also on reading other poets--both contemporary and legendary. If a poet has not done this, then that is where to start. Plus, it wouldn't hurt to join a critique group--whether online or off.
Beyond this simple apprenticeship stage, though, there are some things poets can do. First off, submit to print and online publications that publish poems similar to the ones you write. Having an ear and eye for how your work might fit in with a publication is an art in and of itself, and for many poets it takes a long time to develop this skill. But if you apply yourself and try to learn from both acceptance and rejection, eventually you will get the hang of it.
After you've accumulated some publication credits, you may have enough material to start putting together a collection of work. While you could submit directly to a publisher, the trend increasingly seems to be to submit to chapbook (20-40 page collections) and full-length book competitions (48 or more page collections).
Once you've published your first collection, you can start doing the rounds on the late night talk show circuits and selling out arenas for your mega-popular poetry readings. Okay, so that will likely never happen (but if it does, don't forget your ol' pal, Robert, you hear?).
Here's the super-simplified steps:
1. Read and write a lot of poetry. 2. Get published in print and online publications. 3. Put together a poetry collection.
Simple enough, eh?
If any poets have more to add, be sure to leave a comment below. You know I love hearing from y'all.
Poetry FAQs | Poetry Publishing
Friday, July 11, 2008 12:38:28 AM (GMT Daylight Time, UTC+01:00)
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 Friday, June 27, 2008
Poetry FAQs: Editing Your Poetry
Posted by Robert
TanyaB--one of my friends on Facebook--recently sent me some poetry-related Q's she'd like addressed on the blog. One series (of three) had to do with editing. So, I'm going to list the questions below and try to answer them the best I can. Any blog readers who have a different take are more than welcome to contribute their thoughts in the comments (even if you completely contradict my advice, I'm always open to the possibility of being wrong). :)
Btw, these questions have to do with editing your work.
How do you get started with the editing process?
As far as I'm concerned, the editing process is sometimes going on as early as the actual first draft when I'm deciding what to write. But that said, I often try to just write and let ideas and images come out. When I do this I can sometimes start editing as soon as I finish the draft, but more likely I'll have to let the draft sit for some period of time before revisiting. That period of time could be anywhere from half-an-hour to several weeks (or longer). That's why I copy all my poems down into notebooks--so that I can always revisit old ideas and develop into new pieces if the mood strikes.
There are many things I look for when I revise, but those are based off comments I've received over the years about things I tend to do with my writing. For instance, I try to eliminate the word "it"--unless I can justify its existence. And I prefer active verbs over passive verbs, etc. Also, I read over the poem for rhythm and examine the poem to see if I can give it structure without sacrificing the meaning or flow. And there are many other things--someday I may write a book on them all.
How do you know when it's finished?
A poet friend of mine likes to say that a poem is never finished, and I tend to agree. I mean, look at Leaves of Grass by Walt Whitman--it went through the revision process until there was a "deathbed edition." There's no perfect poem; therefore, you can always play around with them. When you can't find anything new to do to the poem, though, it's usually a good time to try submitting it. If it's accepted, great. If it's rejected, the time apart from the poem may give you new ideas on ways to play with it.
Should you hire an editor or just go with your gut?
I think poets need to develop their guts; I also think poets should never hire an editor. In addition, poets are served well by developing relationships with other poets who can help critique their work. And the critiquing should go both ways. The process of thinking about what works and doesn't work in another's poems can be very beneficial if you then look for similar flaws in your own work. And the feedback you receive from other poets will give you the opportunity to defend your poetic decisions or admit that improvements could be made. No matter what, you should thank anyone who volunteers their time to give you feedback--even if it's not an easy pill to swallow.
Hope that was helpful. And if you have additional comments, please share them with everyone in the comments section below--so the whole group can benefit from your insight.
If you happen to have questions of your own you would like to see addressed on the blog, feel free to send 'em my way with "Poetry FAQs" in the subject line to robert.brewer@fwpubs.com. I can't promise I'll answer them all, but I will try to do what I can.
Advice | Commentary | Personal Updates | Poetry Craft Tips | Poetry FAQs
Friday, June 27, 2008 7:47:05 PM (GMT Daylight Time, UTC+01:00)
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